tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2523357558654725888.post4935521072431934353..comments2024-01-05T11:00:30.673-06:00Comments on DFW Point-to-Point: Stepping Down the Pyramid with MirrorsSteve Ahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13650405341304401203noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2523357558654725888.post-20237109530421225922012-09-12T11:49:39.808-05:002012-09-12T11:49:39.808-05:00Thanks for this analysis. At my deposition, the de...Thanks for this analysis. At my deposition, the defense lawyer implied that mirrors were safety equipment. I have never heard of them classified that, and I have never heard any argument for their safety benefit. I was wondering if I had missed something.Eli Damonhttp://cycles.eli-damon.infonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2523357558654725888.post-76081571878613823182012-09-10T23:02:22.272-05:002012-09-10T23:02:22.272-05:00Mirror is not a substitute for scanning, IMHO!
I l...Mirror is not a substitute for scanning, IMHO!<br />I like having one to keep an eye on the traffic behind me, many times in the lane that I am driving my bicycle in.<br /><br />Very detailed and nice post! Loved reading it, at least 3x.<br /><br />Peace :)GreenComotionhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11272116464292908327noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2523357558654725888.post-33412803815612519662012-09-10T12:44:20.428-05:002012-09-10T12:44:20.428-05:00I swore by my mirror when I started, but now I don...I swore by my mirror when I started, but now I don't use one. I can take 'em or leave 'em, I guess. I do like that you can measure how many cars might be stacking up behind you.RANTWICKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15394479078513545568noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2523357558654725888.post-71625602157963480902012-09-10T12:42:44.504-05:002012-09-10T12:42:44.504-05:00I use a mirror. It's mounted on the handle bar...I use a mirror. It's mounted on the handle bars of my main transportation bicycle. I do not use one on either my Brompton or my "recreation" bicycle -- although my rec bike has camera mounts all over it :-) <br /><br />I think mirror use, like helmet use, is a decision for individual adults to make for themselves. I use one almost entirely because I ride in an urban core with three colleges, i.e. lots of texting and make-up applying students behind the wheels of deadly missiles.<br /><br />I am not a slave to it (if I were, I'd have one on my other bicycles). And there is no substitute I've found for scanning -- if for no other reason than as a signal to motorists that I'm awake and watching.aclinehttp://isocrates.us/bike/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2523357558654725888.post-22638446052006976252012-09-10T01:20:43.613-05:002012-09-10T01:20:43.613-05:00Side mirros just get useful for me when I'm us...Side mirros just get useful for me when I'm using the car but not with a bike. I have always feel secure when I'm riding my bike without having mirrors on them. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2523357558654725888.post-45879357547714887722012-09-09T20:22:48.615-05:002012-09-09T20:22:48.615-05:00As one of your near sighted readers, the mirror (t...As one of your near sighted readers, the mirror (take a look - helmet mounted), helps a lot with lane changes for the reasons you stated.<br />I still find myself reflexively doing a head check, but lack the clarity of vision (edge of the lens) to make them effective.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2523357558654725888.post-60066427097388123462012-09-09T17:36:28.709-05:002012-09-09T17:36:28.709-05:00I use mirrors on cars all the time, to keep me awa...I use mirrors on cars all the time, to keep me aware of what's going on, providing part of the input that goes to make up the whole picture. On a bike I don't think that the image quality available is conducive to easy assimilation of data, and the field of view of just about any bike mirror I have seen has such weaknesses - inevitable with one, imo - that it could lead to a false impression of the surrounding traffic. <br /><br />On a bile, I try to look behind before making any type of manoevre; the lifesaver. I can understand people wanting to use mirrors, but they're not for me.Hamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17182921009517833997noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2523357558654725888.post-17009553505299896472012-09-09T16:54:07.848-05:002012-09-09T16:54:07.848-05:00Nice discussion, Steve. Thank you.
I use a mirro...Nice discussion, Steve. Thank you. <br /><br />I use a mirror on my commuter helmet, but not on my other helmets which do double duty for singletrack or weekend rides. I think they do add situational awareness if checked often and tactically (as I said on the LAB list, the speed differential between bikes and cars makes the dynamics of checking behind a little different). I tend to check the mirror to obtain information on traffic density as I am going into a situation when I am going to have to change lanes, change position in a lane, or get out of the bike lane to occupy a lane, such as when I am coming up on the roundabout near my house. The mirror doesn't take the place of a head swerve to look back at traffic, but it does encourage me to check early on and plan my strategy.<br /><br />Given the rare nature of rear end collisions, I think one would have to be extremely lucky to be looking back just as the one bozo in >10^5 was reaching down to pick up his CD from the floor and suddenly getting squirrel on me. OTOH, a distracted motorist who is all over the road for some distance back might be noticed. Hence my sense that mirrors are oversold as part of the "fear of the rear" syndrome, but are still quite useful.Khalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11866897914538110672noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2523357558654725888.post-19095967688535350722012-09-09T11:15:40.876-05:002012-09-09T11:15:40.876-05:00Anecdotally, I've heard several mirror users c...Anecdotally, I've heard several mirror users claim they avoided side swipes thanks to their mirror. But in all these cases they were riding far right where they were less conspicuous to the averted side swipers than they would be had they been out in the lane with a mirror. <br /><br />Being conspicuously out in the lane greatly reduces the chances of being overlooked in the first place, and with a mirror you're able to distinguish, long before it's too late, those who have noticed you (the vast majority who change lanes or are slowing down) from those who have not (the occasional ones who continue barreling along as if you're not there). <br /><br />When you're off to the side, even with a mirror, you can't tell them apart until it's practically too late to evade because their behavior is virtually indistinguishable. The motorist approaching a cyclist positioned out of his way typically maintains course and speed whether the cyclist is noticed or not. By the time he drifts at the last second, it's usually too late.<br /><br />So, I still believe being out in the lane is a much more effective method than being out of the way and looking for drifters and side-swipers with a mirror. The conspicuous positioning enables you to grab their attention well before you move aside and side swiping even becomes a possibility.<br /><br />I don't know how to measure how much safer the more conspicuous lane positioning that mirror use enables makes a cyclist, but I have no doubt that it makes an enormous positive difference in safety, simply by experiencing how it practically eliminates the close calls and other undesirable situations that occur much more frequently otherwise.Principled Pragmatisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02821076135942791400noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2523357558654725888.post-24644077406208430802012-09-08T22:15:49.095-05:002012-09-08T22:15:49.095-05:00Principled, speaking of your theory, I'm remin...Principled, speaking of your theory, I'm reminded that in theory, theory and practice are the same, but in practice they are not. I do not believe that a mirror can tell you that you need to "bail." I pray and expect neither of us will ever learn the truth in practice. However, I found that the notion of "bailing" was largely an illusion at http://dfwptp.blogspot.com/2011/08/texas-salmon-unique-species.html and I had a LOT clearer view than any mirror. It gave the "danger is ahead" mantra a whole new meaning. Of course, I didn't wave or zig zag and that MIGHT have alerted the salmon an instant quicker. All I know is I do not want an encore to test the theory.Steve Ahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13650405341304401203noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2523357558654725888.post-30555532676772078892012-09-08T20:27:12.146-05:002012-09-08T20:27:12.146-05:00The main reason I use a mirror (glasses mounted Ta...The main reason I use a mirror (glasses mounted Take-A-Look), by far, is to verify periodically (every few seconds) that the lane behind me remains unoccupied, and so I can continue to use the full lane, despite it being wide enough for safe side-by-side travel, or being adjacent to a bike lane. When I do observe traffic approaching from behind in such a situation (there is a bike lane or safe width to move aside into), I predictably look back over my shoulder, and maybe hand signal too, and then move aside, well before they reach me. Then, when I'm passed, I move back into my lane controlling position. Obviously, if traffic is too busy to make that practical (more moving left and right than is required when just moving left and right for intersections), I just stay in the secondary position, at least until I notice a long enough gap again in my mirror. In short, a mirror allows me to use the full lane much more often than when riding without a mirror. The advantages to this are well known: improved vantage to hazards ahead, and improved conspicuousness with respect to all potential traffic conflicts.<br /><br />The second most important reason I use a mirror is when controlling lanes too narrow to be shared, to verify I've been noticed, and to know when to take a measure to elicit a response (changing lanes or slowing to my speed) out of someone approaching from behind. The vast majority slow or change lanes in plenty of time and space, but every once in a while a driver is a trance or something and needs a little nudge. The measures I take are usually just looking back over my shoulder or issuing the slow/stop arm signal, but occasionally I do a few zigs and zags. All these measures are amazingly effective at getting practically instant responses out of even the most brain-dead drivers.<br /><br />In theory a mirror will tell me when the person behind is not reacting to even such efforts, and that I need to "bail", but I've never had that happen, and I don't expect it ever will. I believe taking earlier measures to get noticed is all that is ever required even with a very distracted driver.<br /><br />In short, to evade a collision by swerving at the last instance is not even a reason that makes the list of why I use a mirror.Principled Pragmatisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02821076135942791400noreply@blogger.com